Welcome to the Breakthrough Mastermind podcast. I'm your host Jen Argue, and I facilitate masterminds for women entrepreneurs who want to grow their businesses to help others and create financial independence. I'm so excited to introduce our guests today. Michelle Fernandez is a Facebook and Instagram ads strategist, and funnel expert. Her marketing agency, "Michelle Fernandez Media" creates strategic ad campaigns and highly converting funnels for coaches, course creators and online experts. She is an expert in branding and a vital force behind the continued growth and scale of multiple six and seven figure businesses. Michelle enjoys the strategizing process that takes place prior to running into.
And is a master at getting crystal clear on brand identity messaging and funnel strategy, ensuring maximum ROI for ad spend, which we all love. [laugh] She understands how to combine the most powerful organic paid traffic and funnel strategies to create a successful launch and scaling a business.
Welcome Michelle. I'm so glad to have you here today. Hi! I am so excited to be here. I can't wait to dive in today. Great. So I love to hear the journey that women who are entrepreneurs take to get there, because I know oftentimes it doesn't start out. People don't start out as entrepreneurs, but... what is your journey? How did you get to where you're at today?
Yes. So it was a long journey. Well, because, because of my age, like back then basically I started my career. I wanted to be a teacher. That was something that I always knew I wanted to be, but then I realized, oh, wait a minute. The pay is not where I wanted it to be, to live the lifestyle that I wanted to live.
So I decided to join my mom's company. So she's an entrepreneur. And she had a mortgage business, which I always worked summers and weekends. Like I was never the kid at the beach, like during spring break, I was always at her office. So it was just like a natural fit. And then we kind of became partners and, um, enjoyed a 30 year career with her.
Wow! However, when I was doing it, there were several times in my life where I'm like, Ugh, this is like, I love like helping people fulfill the dream of home ownership. It's the American dream. And I loved really doing what I was doing, but I knew I wanted to do something else. And when my kids were born, I had twins.
I wanted to like, be at home with them, or I wanted to have the flexibility to do more things, and I just didn't know what to do. And at that time it was like a teacher. Cause you had the summers off and that, or it was a pharmaceutical rep. So both of those things, I was thinking from each that I was like, Ooh, not so much.
Right. Fast-forward I decided I'm going to do a beach body workout. [laughs] And I was like, well, what is this whole shake that they sell? And I didn't really know that was a business. I got exposed to Shalene Johnson who was one of the fitness pros and got into her programs. And that's where this whole digital and online world.
That I got expose to, so I never knew about this or what was entailed in it. Um, and so I learned a lot of things with her and I said, okay, I'm gonna make the jump [laughs] and leap. And then I would say I was doing it for like a year or two. And then I finally got up the courage to say, okay, I'm gonna make this my own career.
But what happened was is that I learned so much about more of the attraction marketing and the digital marketing that I was like, oh, I think I might have this other skill, which was with Facebook ads. And a lot of other people have, so I didn't really want to be in network marketing, but I knew I could do this advertising part of it.
So that's kind of what led me to where I am today. And I will tell you, I officially retired. I think it was December 31st, 2019. Then, like having my agency for a couple of years now. And I don't think I can ever go back. We were just talking about that, going back to be boy, having this freedom and living like the dream to be able to go to my kids, you know, college and visit them whenever I want, or my husband and I just to take a quick, the whole freedom part of it and the control of.
My destiny, my life, my every single day is just something that I was like, what did it take me so long to do this? [laughs]
Oh, I totally get that. And I love to say to people when they quit those types of jobs, like being an employee, like congratulations for hiring yourself. Yes. Yes.
That's so awesome. I love that. And we met around that time too. Yes, we did. We did. Yeah. Yeah. What I remember is you had already just made that change of being a Facebook ads manager, and it was exploding for you. Uhmm.
That was that almost like an instant explosion or it was, and it was funny. Coz I so resistant to it because I had a live video course. And so I was selling that and I felt comfortable, but again, I was like, and then one of the girls in my mastermind, this is the beauty of masterminds with who you network with and stuff.
She kept kind of almost being annoying about it. Like you should do this for other people. I'm like, no, no, no, no, it's not my jam. I feel like I guess I was not confident enough at that time. Coz I was like, I'd be willing to risk my money and my things on my own stuff, but I didn't feel I could do it for someone else.
And so she's like, okay, like just do it. Like I'll trust you enough to do it for me. [laughs] So I was like okay, And then it was just like, oh, I can't do this. And it's like, kind of building that confidence muscle. Coz sometimes I think we think like, it comes easy to me, so it must come easy for everybody else. Right. Exactly!
So that got me to really realize that maybe this is my zone of genius, you know, or this is. You know, not something everybody else can do that I can help them get seen and get out there and grow their business. Um, with a, with a little skill that I have that I didn't think was a big deal, you know? Yes. So, yeah. So just by word of mouth, we were try about referrals. Uhmm.
That's how things just started going. That is amazing. And I think that is such a beautiful start to your business, that you had someone who believed in you really speak that truth to you. And to actually put her money where her mouth was. And say. Do it for me. Yeah. I trust you enough to run ads for my business and to really build you up in that way, just to have somebody like that in your life.
I think I'm just going to do a side note for like me and you and anybody who's listening. If you can be that for somebody else, if you see that potential in somebody else, you have no idea how that could change the trajectory of their life for the good. Uhmm. And to go ahead and speak those words to them because we all need those words spoken to us.
I love that. Yeah. And that, and here's the thing. And we talk about this and we met in a group coaching program, right. Or in a mastermind ish, is that a lot of people feel that, or my gosh, this investment is a lot, right? Like, is it worth the investment? Am I going to get a return on my investment back? And I always say, That it's not always the financial return that you get.
It's the relationships that you build in this particular case that got me now to have a business that I love. Right. And I'm able to help other people that I probably wouldn't have helped without this conversation. Right. So it's kind of like when you're looking at some of these things and you're looking to grow your business, it's like, who are you surrounding yourself with?
And we were talking about that. That's like, like the quote that everybody hears, but it's so true. It's like, who are you spending your time with? Because in this world where I am, where you are, it's like we're by ourselves all day long. It's important to have that group of people that does cheer you on and support you and encourage you and all that good stuff, too.
That's a crucial, vital to growing your business ideal. Right. Right. And not just to surround yourself with anybody, but the right people. Uhmm. Who are speaking that truth to you and who are also as go getters as you. [laughs]. I don't know what the word for that is. [laughs] Well, thank you for sharing that. I love hearing your story of how you came to that and, and that that person came into your life at the right time.
Oh, it's so good. So what I love to learn from everybody, and what I'm trying to bring out in the podcast is the behind the scenes. What is it for you that really made a big difference in your business growth? And we did touch upon the interacting with people, the referrals, and with business there's often the soft skills and the hard skills. And when we concentrate too much on one, we can be lopsided and not really experienced the full potential of growth that is there for us. So I like to highlight both what for you is a soft skill that really made a big difference for you. Hmm, do I just get to pick one? [laughs] You can get as many as you want.
Um, and it's funny because there's so many things, right. Especially when you're first getting started, you get exposed to all these, what I call famous people, and then you start comparing yourself like, coz they share their highlights. So I got from here to here. And like two days, I went from zero to a million and it took me a whole two days.
And then, so now you're like, oh my gosh, it would surely take me two days or 30 days or whatever it is to get it done. So I found myself kind of going in, in more of a downward spiral because I wasn't moving at the pace that I thought I should be, or, you know what I mean? It's like, but it wasn't in, sometimes I wasn't even being realistic to what those were because I didn't know.
I was just making up the story of what I thought it was on the other side. Right. So I literally had to tell myself, and this was even back when I was learning Facebook ads. I remember I was like, all right, I'm going to learn. I know we're talking about hard skill, but it was more mentally putting those blinders on. Like, this is what I'm going to learn and I'm going to go through it and anything I'm going to read.
Listen to watch is only going to be about the one thing. So I don't get distracted and that shiny object syndrome, because there were podcasts, it would be like every week you should be doing this or you should be doing that. And it'd be like, I can't keep up with doing all the things. Right. So it was just saying singly focused on one thing to then get to the next thing.
Another thing that's really helped me. Basically to separate my emotions from whatever the outcome was. Right. Because we're all doing something for the first time and it may not be a six figure launch. It may not be any launch, but you're always learning something from it. And it doesn't like nothing has meaning, but the meaning that you give it.
So that was also something I had to learn. It's just like, no, no, no. This is all just learning. Like it's all about the data and. The drama. So it's kind of like, let me just kind of put my head on straight and the only way I'm going to learn anything is by doing right and taking that action. And to go on the third point I would say is that no one is going to save, right.
It's my responsibility. I found myself in times where it was like, well, this coach that I hired is going to do this for me, or I'm counting. And then it was like, no, no, no, whatever self doubt or imposter syndrome or whatever, then I'm feeling like I need to work myself out of it. They're here to guide me.
But I'm the one that has to make those actions or those things happen because it's like, how bad do I want it? Am I willing to work through this? Or do I need to go back to that? Nine to five? There was no way that was happening. Right. [laughs] Oh, you are speaking some hard rock here. Its true. And it's so funny because like, I think even to this, obviously, I think no.
And if anybody tells you otherwise, I think they're a big fat liar because I think that we all have self doubt to some point. Right. About no matter what we're doing at that next level, that imposter syndrome, it's always just going to be there. So it's all about recognizing that you're in it, right? How can you become more aware and how can you snap out of it quicker?
Like what can I be doing right now. Uhm. To move forward or recognizing like what's stopping me from doing or taking these actions that I need to take to move forward. And I think a lot of times, a lot of us just kind of push that aside. But that's, what's gonna stop you from getting to that next level. Ahmm. Uhmm. So did you feel like there was a turning point for you when you started to really incorporate those things?
Yes. I'm trying to think which time, cause I've had several breakdowns that led to breakthroughs because I think what happens is you just beat yourself up. I just beat myself up over and over again. And it wasn't until I had to say to myself, like I have to trust that I'm doing everything. I know that I have with my knowledge, my skills right now, the power to do, and that whatever's coming.
I have to trust that in due time it will be here, you know, instead of saying what I don't have, or I'm not there yet. It's like, okay, Well, I am doing this so I know it will come. Right. I heard once from Jen Casey she's and I literally pray this every day. I say, thank you for all that I have. And for everything that's already on its way.
And when I heard her say that, I was like, yes, yes, this is what it is. Coz I was always like another month, another whatever, you know what I mean? But I'm like, when I look at it as from the whole like, it's like, oh wait, I have gone far there. Then I think that I am going to stay by day. Does that make sense? You know what I'm saying.
Yes. Yes. I mean, we can't see our own progress if we're just looking at our business from day-to-day, Uhmm. We have to look at it from a bigger perspective to be able to see that growth and to realize that so much has already come our way to trust that. More it's still on its way. Yes. Yes. And even just, you asked for another turning point, I think even in the point of me taking on this whole new agency endeavor, I was really questioning myself, like, do I know enough?
Can I help people enough for, and then I said, no, no, no, I need to own what I know. Right. And stand in that power of that. I know it. And then know within myself that I'm resourceful enough that I can figure it out. Right. I have my network of people. I know where to go, to find an answer, to figure it out. So I think that was also a turning point for me to be trusting in my own self and my ability to do those things.
It's true. You have just laid before us so many gems. I feel like we could just stop the podcast right now. [laughs] This has been great. Thanks, Jen, [laughs] honestly, so good from the beginning, when you were talking about putting them blinders, even, you know, all that is so amazing and so true and taking responsibility and recognizing that good is coming your way and claiming that acknowledging that, which helps you look for it and see it. Uhmm. And receive it.
Uhmm. When it comes so all so good. I'm so glad you brought those up as the soft skills, because I don't think people realize what a difference that makes it really doesn't. And then like, I will say that, I mean, I sound so like put together right now, but back then I was like, it was a daily struggle. You know, thinking that, how am I going to get through this?
Am I ever going to realize my dream? And I remember hearing people say, just trust, just trust, just the, and I would be like, how is that even possible? But it's literally, if you just let go of that worry and like kind of push that down a little bit. Yeah. It just happens without genome. It's strangest thing. I believe it it's.
Does it feel like one day you just wake up and it's like, oh, I will tell you. Yes, because I'm a very like anxious person, like by my hands, sweat. And like, I like my whole body reacts to everything, which I dunno. Does that happen to other [laughs] people? I feel like I'm not the only one. No! Um, but sometimes I'm like, like I'll be in the middle that something will come up.
What I think is like a major something. And, um, and then all of a sudden I'm like, Hey, wait a minute. I'm not even sweating right now. Like, what's going on? [laughs] Like, I think there's something wrong with me. Right. But it's because like, without even knowing it, it's like just kind of fades away because you, you become so aware of like, okay, I see this, I know there's a solution.
I will find it. You know what I mean? So it, it, it doesn't even allow you to, to go that route. I don't know if that makes sense, but. Uhm. You're right. It's just like, Yeah, it totally does. And I think each time it comes around, then you're more equipped the next time. And it doesn't seem as hard even though it's very real.
It doesn't seem as hard. Yeah. I love all of those soft skills and we know that having some hard skills is important, too. What for you has been the biggest difference as far as actual strategy that you've applied or anything else? That's more of a hardest. So I think that, especially with what I do with Facebook ads, like Facebook is changing every fight. [laughs]
It's not funny, but it is. But what it's really taught me is to go back to like, um, like certain skills that stand the test of time. So even just with your relationships, with making connections with people, with networking, right. And using those, I think goes way back. So when you go back to your basic skills of knowing what a marketing funnel is, or knowing how to get yourself out there to be seen in order to sell, like, those are types of things that no matter what's going on, no matter what platform you're advertising on, those are the skills that you really need to do.
Can I get down because that's the only way you're going to grow your business, right? With a steady flow of new people coming into getting to know who you are, Uhmm. But, you know, organically when people say like organic marketing, it's usually what I see, like hosting on social posting on my feed or DM me people.
Right. Those types of things where it's like, okay, how can you take that? But to reach other people without. Let's say paid advertising. Well, when you're in these masterminds or in these group, coachings, how can you get yourself into a room where now you can get on someone else's platform provide value to their audience.
And now you've just reached another bigger group of people where it's not just on, I don't want to say your little Instagram, but compared to global or, you know, another big platform. It is small compared to this, and those are other ways that you can do those things. So there's a lot of skills that I think everybody needs to learn.
Do I think you need to be a genius at it, or that's your zone of genius? Not necessarily, but you need to have, I think those of marketing skills to market yourself. Uhmm, uhmm. And you really are the expert on this. We were talking earlier, before we started the podcast about how you helped an entrepreneur achieved the two comma club. Uhmm.
Yeah. And so your understanding of funnels and what it takes to get there is spot on you've got it down. What would you say is important as far as building that funnel and whether you're fueling it organically or through paid ads, um, what would you say is important to be able to get that type of traction to achieve a goal like that?
It's all about testing, right? So I would say when you... when you rewind back and you were even talking about your market research, I think that is crucial. And I don't think everybody does it. Or if they do, do it, they do it once. And I think that's something that you should constantly be going back and revisiting because just like the world is changing, you know, like you might think, you know, the person, well, maybe they now have a new problem.
Right. Or maybe they. Have a problem that they don't know there's a solution for. So there's all kinds of ways that you look at it, not only who you should be targeting or going after what your person is, but it also helps you with your value ladder or your next product that maybe now they developed this new problem.
And you're like, Hey, I can totally solve that problem for them, which is then going to generate more revenue for you. Right. As well as you're helping a lot more people and getting that done. So it's all just about doing the research. Figuring out how you can solve that problem and putting it together in a nice little package that's totally irresistible.
Right? You always hear the irresistible offer. And then even just looking at like, how can you tweak it to make sure the pricing is on point? Or if you're saying, oh my gosh, all these people are buying, paying in full at a $6,000, you know, price. Then can I increase the price to, you know, 8,000, 10,000 or something like that, to then increase your, your revenue.
And then also, what are you looking at them to get them into your next step of your value letter? Like how are you retaining those people or reselling or upselling them into your funnel? And I think that's where a lot of people miss out is they think that the transaction just stops with the sale. But it doesn't, it happens in the transformation, right?
So as they're learning and going through it, they might love working with you. And if you're not giving them the next step to go to, to continue on their journey with you as their guide, they're going to go to your competitor. Right. So that is, I think something really what I've been working with most of my clients with is to seeing, like, are you giving them another opportunity to continue working with you?
And I think a lot of people kind of. Just say, oh no, I made those sales. I hit my goal. I'm moving on, but don't leave those people, you know, out there. It is such an important thing. That lifetime value of a customer. Yes, it's one of the most important numbers. Uhmm. I love that you're highlighting that. And so it sounds like. For you, keeping it simple is really important having that value ladder or your ascension model or whatever it is, the levels of offers that you have that take people one step further each time so that they stay in your, um, realm of service. Uhmm. And that in, do you feel like people that start to get.
Too many courses or their offers are competing with each other in the value model. Do you see that effort? Yes. There's a couple of clients that I worked with where they had a lot of lower ticket offers. So a lot of like 97, 250, something like that, 300, 297, whatever. And then it was kind of like set of like a ladder.
It was very like. Uhmm. a linear. [laughs] It's very linear. So there was no place for them to grow and then either their products competed or they were totally opposite. So they thought, oh, I'm going to provide a webinar course, oh, I'm going to provide a, you know, traction marketing course. I'm going to put, so it's like, yeah, I need all things, but then eventually people just are like, okay, what now?
What? I don't need to know the basics. I need to dive deeper. I need to learn what it's like to grow and scale my business to put systems in place and things like that, that they're not getting from a foundational course. And so I think we're where I see a lot of hesitation or resistance into moving forward is because they thinking price.
Oh, well, people find value in this, or my people will only spend 297. They're not going to spend 2,000 or they're not going to spend 10,000. Right. But how do you know, [laughs] have you asked them or have they gotten this taste from you and then saw, oh my gosh, my business is growing for this. Can you imagine how much more money John's gonna make me if I get more coaching from her and she used to guide you.
You know, I think that that's where a lot of people kind of miss the mark there. That's really wise. And I can imagine that you have that, that view into so many people's businesses that you can see which ones are doing really well and which ones are struggling and why just, uhmm, from connecting the dots between what you're observing,uhmm.
Even like, like when clubhouse came out, like everybody's all the houses. Right. But then we're kind of moving away from that. However, during that time, when something new is coming out, like I had a couple of clients that put some things together about clubs, so that kind of made their offer seem more irresistible or like, oh, I need to learn more.
About this clubhouse thing. Right? So it's even just being aware of what kind of bonuses or what kind of something can you add? That's trendy, but it's still kind of hitting those things, but you're getting them in there with what's going on now. Yeah. Yeah. And it sounds like those people, they fall in this category that I like to call it.
Get ready to be ready. Uhmm, You know, [laugh] like their funnel was there. Yes, yes. Tweaked the way that they messaged to it. Yeah. Or, or their beginning offer. Uh, was that attraction type of marketing that a felt need that was felt urgent probably too many, but then once they were in, they were ready for them. Yes. Able to take them through their funnel. Uhmm.
For sure. Yeah. That's amazing. Okay. So thank you so much for sharing the soft skills, the hard skills that you, you really, uh, gave us so much value today. [laughs] Um, one question I like to ask people typically, The women that I've worked with, have a hard time stepping away from work because they love what they do and their work is play.
But we know that we need to always be investing into our souls to be able to keep our energy levels where they need to be, to run the businesses that we want to be running. What is it for you that really, um, feels like radical self care for you. Radical. It's funny that you're saying this. I just have to add this in here because I don't know if that's [laughs] the right person to be asking, oh, but my son just moved to Charlotte.
And so he's been, we've been kind of coordinating, coming home for the holidays. And every time he calls me, I'm sitting right here at my desk. He's like, mom, do you ever give her, like, leave your desk? [laughs] Wow! I'm like, thank you for that reminder. [laughs] I'm getting up right. [laughs] Um, so yes, so radical is really, yeah. Um, [laughs] no, it is, it is actually being more aware and it's, and it's funny because sometimes it's hard for me to walk away, but the moment I do, I come back so much more like refresh recharge.
More creative. Right. So I have to remind myself, okay. As much as you kind of want to check everything off before you go, it's okay. That you're not like you can go watch the real housewives for, I was also made a commitment to myself that once a month I'm getting a massage and once a month I'm getting a facial. And then, then it's like, I just feel like I'm doing something more for myself and it's not just all about work.
Uhm, Is that radical? [laughs] That is radical. And wow thank you to your son for being honest. Oh my gosh. [laughs] I know it's like the reality. It's like, ah, but honestly like being an empty nester, sometimes it's like, what do I do with my time? you know, Yeah. Oh, I experienced that too. Now that I'm an empty-nester it's like, oh, I've got all this free time and we'd start amping up the level that we're paying attention to our businesses. Uhmm.
And then it's almost hard to like pull back. And be like, oh, I, but I want to go out and spend time with my kids. And I want go out, do these things with friends and pull away from the desks or [laughs] that always puts us backdrop. Yeah, I write. And it's funny coz we live in Miami, so very similar weather to you. So we have a pool.
So that was one of the things that I forced myself. We call it pool time. So my husband leaves work at 3:30 and it's like, we're in the pool. By four o'clock. And so I'm like, I'm on a deadline, but I love it because like we have pool time, you know, we put little or d'oeuvres out and it really forces. Even if I come back later and wrap up for my day, it was, it's like taking that break for an hour or two is, oh my gosh, huge.
You know, you can have your computer in the pool. [laughs] So, totally rubbed me. [laughs] Yes. And then it's kind of like, you're on vacation all the time. You know what I mean? So, yes! Oh, my gosh. I might steal that from you. Yes! I love that pool time with charcuterie. Yes! [laughs] Exactly what it looks like. [laughs]
That is awesome. Thank you for sharing that. If people want to spend some more time with you, hang out with you, where would you recommend they go? Yeah, I do have a podcast to trafficking conversion shows, so it's all about running traffic and getting your offers to convert. And then you can find me on social @themichellefernandez.
Awesome. And, and I can vouch, um, Michelle really gives so much value in her podcast and on her social. So, definitely go give her a follow. Thank you. Thank you, Michelle.
I'm so grateful. We had Michelle Fernandez on the show today. All the links to get in touch with her and to hang out with her will be in the show notes.
And if you're looking for more support, challenge and inspiration in running your online business, I would love to have you apply to my mastermind.
Check it out! @jenargue.com.
